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Wen Surgery on an Oranda Goldfish

Discussion in 'Goldfish Clinic' started by *Ci*, May 12, 2009.

  1. aimeekat

    aimeekat Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2010
    Location:
    wichita kansas
    i have an oranda about 4 1/2 inches. its cheeks are growing up over its eyes (75-80% covered already) he seems happy and healthy, only thing i notice is that when he eats i have to feed him floating oranda or he darts to bottom to get the sinking food and hits his head. is it possible for him to live happy life without a wen trim or am i most likely going to have to do this procedure. i know this probably stupid question but does it make any difference that it is cheeks coming up instead of head flopping over (guess i am hoping for a positive answer lol) i put him in different tank now than fish i feed blood worms because i have noticed a very big jump in wen growth since i started about 4 weeks ago, i hope that helps some. is there anything else i can do to help this not get worse he seems to see very well except when he used to try to get to the ranchus sinking food (little piglet).
     
  2. aimeekat

    aimeekat Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2010
    Location:
    wichita kansas
    forgot to attatch the pictures. here are some photos of cheeky. not sure if it helps to see him.
     

    Attached Files:

  3. johnatoranchu

    johnatoranchu Ambassador

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2008
    Location:
    England, near London
    This is precisely the method I use Steve. Simple, fast and effective.
    John
     
  4. TheTruth

    TheTruth Professional Breeder

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2009
    Location:
    ny state
    wen problems

    the wen pulls away from the eye if you press slightly under the eye allowing cutting to take place .i dont know if this was mentioned as i am in a rush.saw your latest printout and like the proposed ranchu look good luck john h
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2011
  5. fantailer

    fantailer Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2013
    Location:
    USA
    Good job with the surgery!

    I have never seen this done before!
     
  6. bham

    bham Member

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2012
    Location:
    canada
    Just performed this on my goldfish and worked great. The 5 drops per gallon of clove oil to water was perfect and I was able to start trimming after 8 minutes in the clove oil bath. I used high end curved scissors and blunt tweezers. I got enough off to give her sight in both eyes but I wish I had gotten more off. I will probably have to do this again in the future and would appreciate any input into the best tools for trimming.
     
  7. Jennnnya

    Jennnnya New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2014
    Location:
    Ny white plains
    [​IMG] can someone help me what's wrong with my orange cap oranda what's that spot on its wen??


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  8. Deleted User

    Deleted User Guest

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2014
    Location:
    Cloverdale California USA
    Excellent job!

    Excellent job!

    I've always been afraid to do surgery on anything smaller than a cat. I've always heard having a wen could be problematic, but it was always dismissed with "goldfish have an excellent sense of smell". You did the right thing, and so bravely too. My hat is off to you. :eek:mg:

    Glenn
     
  9. GoldfishDude

    GoldfishDude Banned

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2015
    Location:
    Santa Clara CA
    Thank you Goldie Guru!

    That is exactly what I needed. And the URL's were educational tool I'm going to have a vet help me so she will have all super sharp instruments. They will not slip.

    Thank you again for your help.

    GoldfishDude
     
  10. *Ci*

    *Ci* Goldie Guru

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2009
    Location:
    BC, Canada
    Thanks, Goldfishdude. If you try trimming a wen, get someone to take pictures to post! Good luck :)
     
  11. Fishdork

    Fishdork Professional Breeder

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2008
    Location:
    Salem, OR USA
    With oil of Cloves (Eugenol) I've always read use 3-5 drops per gallon. Mix the eugenol extremely well before adding the fish. It balls up in clumps on the bottom of the container.
    The first time I tried it, I put 3 small koi in a bucket, then added the eugenol. I returned the fish to two different tanks with other fish. A couple days later, those 3 fish looked like the had been dropped in boiling water. Eugenol is used by dentists on teeth, but it can burn peoples' gums.
    The droppers I have deliver differing amounts per 'drop'. Do not overdose. When I'm giving injections, I leave them for the minimum amount of time, but if trimming around the eyes, a sudden thrash from the fish can have disastrous results.

    Norm
     
  12. GoldfishDude

    GoldfishDude Banned

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2015
    Location:
    Santa Clara CA
    Trimming of goldfish wen

    The dropper was extra small and seemed to give out extra small droplets so I put in 15 drops instead of 10 per gallon. Mistake. I reapportioned the water and sedated my fish. Dr. Newman said the wen looked like it was filled with synovial fluid but was sure that was incorrect. There front desk person Jenifer got before and after pictures as well as some video. I'm just waiting for her to email it to me The wen did not slip as the instruments were surgically sharp and cut away quite easily. There were two fish and it only took about 20 minutes per side. The seemed to get their bearings quickly after being put back into the bucket with regular water. Only one has a little black on his wen (which is what goldfish do when healing). Instead of sitting on the bottom of the tank and only responding when food is present they now swim the tank freely and pick off pellets with precision. Dr. Sylvia Newman and her assistant donated their time and instruments so it cost me nothing. To reciprocate I am setting up one of my larger extra tanks in their waiting room stocked with fish from dandyorandas.com

    GoldFishDude
     
  13. *Ci*

    *Ci* Goldie Guru

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2009
    Location:
    BC, Canada
    Do you have before and after pictures to share?
     
  14. Blueheeler

    Blueheeler Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2015
    Location:
    Australia
    Ci how is your fish doing now? Is it swimming around more now that he can see?
     
  15. *Ci*

    *Ci* Goldie Guru

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2009
    Location:
    BC, Canada
    The wen trim was done back in 2009. I have since moved and downsized and sold all of my indoor fish tanks including that Oranda. I only have outdoor ponds and fish now, so that I can take extended winter vacations.
    But for the year following the surgery, yes, the fish swam better, had improved balance and could find and eat food more easily.
     
  16. Columnmn

    Columnmn Active Member

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2014
    Location:
    Adelaide, Australia
    I just noticed my d*&khead fish (we named him that) swimming around upside down on the bottom of the pond, I took him out to have a better look:
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Looks like I'll be trying this out soon!
     
  17. Columnmn

    Columnmn Active Member

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2014
    Location:
    Adelaide, Australia
    Actually, a question for the pros.

    Is the wen also the part below the eyes as well, or just above?

    It seems to be closing in from both sides.
     
  18. *Ci*

    *Ci* Goldie Guru

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2009
    Location:
    BC, Canada
    It is, but if this were my fish I would just trim the portion right over the eye, and round the top of the wen a little to give it a more even shape. Try to lift the area over the eye with smothing thin and flat like a metal nail file or blunt knife. If it is too hard to lift away from the eye you might not want to risk cutting there.

    If you do the procedure post some pics on this thread!
     
    Last edited: Oct 18, 2017
  19. Columnmn

    Columnmn Active Member

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2014
    Location:
    Adelaide, Australia
    I did the surgery last night, it all went well, and he can see again, and seems to be swimming around happily.

    I left the part on the back of his head, I kind of like his fro.

    I can do one better on the photos, I've got a youtube channel, so I took a video, I'll chop it together soon :)
     
    chocky likes this.
  20. Columnmn

    Columnmn Active Member

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2014
    Location:
    Adelaide, Australia
    Just so I can be accurate in the video, how long can they safely stay out of the water while I'm chopping away. I got nervous when I was doing my fish, and kept putting him back in. But it'd be good to know.

    Thanks.
     

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